71S Kennedy Half Dollar RPM?

[atrox001]

Would this be an RPM? This is from a 71S proof Kennedy Half Dollar. I don’t see anything like it in the CONECA listings...would I be wasting my $8 if I sent it to James Wiles?

Thank You,
Larry Nienaber

[wavysteps]

Hi Larry - Yes I would send it in. However, since Mike Ellis has taken over as the head attribution for this type coin, he is the one to speak too. Also, you may want to try John Bordner over in NCADD; he is the head of the rpm division of the Wexler files.

BJ Neff

[Tim]

Hi Larry - Yes I would send it in. However, since Mike Ellis has taken over as the head attribution for this type coin, he is the one to speak too. Also, you may want to try John Bordner over in NCADD; he is the head of the rpm division of the Wexler files.

BJ Neff

I was going to keep my opinion to myself but.....

Don't waste your money sending this RPM to Mike Ellis, if the RPM is not in the CONECA files then Ellis can not list a new coin. In the end, the coin would have to be sent to Wiles anyhow to get a new listing so why not avoid the waste of time and funds and just submit to Wiles in the first place.

I would recommend sending Wiles an email with the photo attached and ask him if he felt it was worth submitting. I think it is worth submitting, it looks like a nice split on the top of the S.

Wexler's files remind me of that Life cereal commercial, you know the one “Let Mikey try it, he will eat anything.” In this case, “he will list anything.”

Sorry if I sound so negative but since I found out about the “Licensing Agreement” that our Board and Officers signed last fall when they ….. Let me just say that all that voted for this “Licensing Agreement”, they should just resign. It does nothing positive for the Club or Membership

[19Lyds]

I was going to keep my opinion to myself but.....

Don't waste your money sending this RPM to Mike Ellis, if the RPM is not in the CONECA files then Ellis can not list a new coin. In the end, the coin would have to be sent to Wiles anyhow to get a new listing so why not avoid the waste of time and funds and just submit to Wiles in the first place.

I would recommend sending Wiles an email with the photo attached and ask him if he felt it was worth submitting. I think it is worth submitting, it looks like a nice split on the top of the S.

Wexler's files remind me of that Life cereal commercial, you know the one “Let Mikey try it, he will eat anything.” In this case, “he will list anything.”

Sorry if I sound so negative but since I found out about the “Licensing Agreement” that our Board and Officers signed last fall when they ….. Let me just say that all that voted for this “Licensing Agreement”, they should just resign. It does nothing positive for the Club or Membership

Email me with what you're talking about Tim. 19Lyds@suddenlink.net

As for the mintmark in the OP. It's very similar to the MMS-002C except it's definitely an MMS-001 mintmark. James should probably examine it.

Hopefully, it'll get RPM Status as I have a couple in my Kennedy Proof Sets!

[19Lyds]

Wait a minute. Isn't this RPM-001 S/S West?

http://www.varietyvista.com/Variety%...ms.htm#_1971-S

Or am I messing up my interpretation?

[atrox001]

19Lyds...I don’t think this would be the 50c 71S RPM-001, it is not re-punched west.

I think you are confusing things when you bring back my mint mark post from 24 November 2009...the two mint marks are not the same.

Thank you all for your comments...I was just trying to get someone to confirm my thoughts that this is an RPM. I am going to send this in to James Wiles.

Larry Nienaber


By the way this is a MMS-001, not close to a MMS-002.

[jcuve]

I agree it does not appear to be RPM-001, rather, a new find (congrats!).

It wouldn't be a waste of money to send it to Ellis as he wouldn't take someone's money if it wasn't listed already. Yes, Wiles adds to the CONECA files whereas Ellis attributes previously listed varieties within the files. Anyone who has an opinion on what transpired last year with the BOD and the licensing issue is free to make it; I was not on the BOD at that time and am still trying to understand it all.

Again congrats on the find and tell us what Wiles states after viewing the coin.

[Tim]

I agree it does not appear to be RPM-001, rather, a new find (congrats!).

It wouldn't be a waste of money to send it to Ellis as he wouldn't take someone's money if it wasn't listed already. Yes, Wiles adds to the CONECA files whereas Ellis attributes previously listed varieties within the files. Anyone who has an opinion on what transpired last year with the BOD and the licensing issue is free to make it; I was not on the BOD at that time and am still trying to understand it all.

Again congrats on the find and tell us what Wiles states after viewing the coin.

Mr. Cuvelier,

If the coin in question is not all ready listed in CONECA’S files, not only would it be a waste of money to pay for postage and insurance both ways to send it to Mr. Ellis but the submitter would unnecessarily be taking a chance that the Post Office would lose the coin.

I am sure that Mr. Ellis is very knowledgeable about varieties but does he have photographs or examples of all the varieties to make comparisons to or does he just have the written descriptions from the CONECA’S files to work with? In the series that I collect with my son, Kennedy half dollars, some of the varieties are so close even with markers that I feel the written description alone without examples either in hand or by photographs to visually confirm will make it difficult for any attributor to accurately state what the variety is. To make this point, I would be willing to send Mr. Ellis a box of ten coins for attribution and if he has over eighty percent accuracy on this submission, I will donate $100 to the YN education fund if each elected official of CONECA would be willing to donate half of the amount ($50 each) to the YN education fund if Mr. Ellis is less then eighty percent accurate.

A debate over what ever happened last fall between our Elected Officials and Dr. Wiles concerning the “Licensing Agreement” or “Contract” should probably be a separate thread. But since you and another member brought up submitting coins to Mr. Ellis, I do have a few questions that maybe you could answer.

1. When did the Elected Officials name Mr. Ellis as an attributor for 20th and 21st U.S. Coins?
2. Will Mr. Ellis be attributing according to the CONECA numbering system?
3. How can the Elected Officials of CONECA give Mr. Ellis authorization / permission to utilize the CONECA numbering system when they already signed a contract with Dr. Wiles giving him “exclusive, worldwide, time-limited (for the Term (ten years)) license to employ, reproduce, reprint, publish and otherwise use the System"?
4. What does the word “exclusive” mean?
5. Would this be what they call a “Breech of Contract”?
6. Have our Elected Officials put our Club in jeopardy of liability?
7. Have our Elected Officials put themselves, individually, in jeopardy of liability?
8. There are several more questions that should be asked, but I will save them for another day.

Sincerely,

Timothy A. Clough, Member # N - 4363

[atrox001]

I think you are making a lot of very good points Tim, and asking a lot of very good questions. It seems to me that the current Board and President have really screwed up the attribution process.

Larry Nienaber

[jcuve]

Tim,

Thank you for the reply. I will look into the matter and forward your questions and concerns and see if I can relay an answer to you.

Jason

[diamond]

To answer your questions, Tim:

1. When did the Elected Officials name Mr. Ellis as an attributor for 20th and 21st U.S. Coins?

A few months ago.

2. Will Mr. Ellis be attributing according to the CONECA numbering system?

Yes.

3. How can the Elected Officials of CONECA give Mr. Ellis authorization / permission to utilize the CONECA numbering system when they already signed a contract with Dr. Wiles giving him “exclusive, worldwide, time-limited (for the Term (ten years)) license to employ, reproduce, reprint, publish and otherwise use the System"?

Anyone can use the numbering system. It's in the public domain. James has voiced no objection and approves of the club appointing Mike Ellis as our 20th century die variety guru.

4. What does the word “exclusive” mean?

It means James has exclusive access to the files and the exclusive right to generate books from them.

5. Would this be what they call a “Breach of Contract”?

No.

6. Have our Elected Officials put our Club in jeopardy of liability?

No.

7. Have our Elected Officials put themselves, individually, in jeopardy of liability?

No.

James prefers to spend his time now writing books. Mike Ellis has a large reference library and can handle most known varieties. If a variety looks like it's unlisted and appears to be significant, he'll forward it to James. If he deems it insignificant, Mike won't bother James with it or add it to the CONECA files.

--Mike Diamond

[Tim]

Hi Larry - Yes I would send it in. However, since Mike Ellis has taken over as the head attribution for this type coin, he is the one to speak too. Also, you may want to try John Bordner over in NCADD; he is the head of the rpm division of the Wexler files.

BJ Neff

This must be another one of Mr. Neff's erroneous statements, he seems good at not being very factual.

[diamond]

Mike Ellis pre-screens the submissions and attributes them if he can find a match with his database. I don't see what's particularly inaccurate about BJ's statement. If you're going to criticize, Tim (and that's about all you do), you should at least back up that criticism with some facts.

[wavysteps]

You seem to have a problem TIM. Are you that frustrated and must demean other people to elevate your self esteem or is it just a natural tendency of yours?

BJ Neff

[atrox001]

This 50c 71S came back as "RPM is too minor to list".

Larry Nienaber