Latest Die Variety News now online

[diamond]

Billy Crawford's terminally interesting online magazine.

http://home.sc.rr.com/dievarieties/D...iety_News.html

[garryn]

John Adams Doubled Die

Hi, I am Garry and I just joined the forum. I found Billy Crawford's online magazine very interesting. It is the first time I have seen it. On page 13 he discusses the John Adams dollar doubled die and describes the "extra raised remnants" at the juncture of the arm and the cloak on Liberty as evidence of the doubled die. But I cannot see for sure what is doubled there. For example, he says that the doubling "originates within the folds of the design", but the design of the cloak has a curve shaped like a U at the top and the remnant has a curve shaped like an inverted U at the top of it. Is it possible that it is a die break? Does anyone have any comments?

[wavysteps]

Hi Garry - First, let me welcome you to this form, happy to see you over on this one.

I believe that John Wexler has three different dies that show this minor doubling. Although I have not had one in hand, I feel confident that it is a doubled die if John has classified it as such.

It also seems that you are correct for it does appear that the curved part of the doubled die is more concave shaped while the vast majority of the folds in the robe of Liberty are convex in shape. To speculate exactly what part of a design element is doubled, it would be hard to say without having that die in front of you.

While they are a fairly minor doubled die, it is the first for the Presidential dollar and I am sure that we will be subjected to more on this denomination coin. Interestingly enough, Robert Piazza saw a Washington dollar with "trails" and I am very confident of that report; just wish that I had one to photograph.

Once again Garry, glad to see you using this forum.

BJ Neff

[garryn]

Thanks for the welcome, BJ. Glad to be here. My only point is the only doubled dies I am familiar with exhibit a secondary image immediately adjacent to the primary. That does not seem to be the case here. It definitely is a mystery.

[JamesWiles]

I too remain skeptical about these being doubled dies. I would like to see overlays showing just what part of the design is doubled. With such a small area affected, I would think it would be difficult to prove.

[garryn]

James, There is an article on two similar anomalies on the George Washington dollar in the same area on the coin in the August 20 Coin World, page 42 in John Wexler's Varieties Notebook column. Mr. Wexler attributes it to the theory of tilting of the planchet or the hub in relation to one another. He adds "Since the face of the die is slightly conical... it is the center of the die that first makes contact and is the most likely location for doubling to occur." So the die contacts the planchet in the tilted position then snaps into place and creates the coin. No offense to Mr. Wexler, but I am a little skeptical. It may have happened that way, but why call it a doubled die?

In the examples that are illustrated in the Varieties Notebook column the "remnant" is smaller than that on the Adams dollar in Billy Crawford's article.