1956 PR Quarter DDO/DDR Discovery

[Coindog]

This is another from the proof sets I got at the estate auction. It's also another DDO/DDR that doesn't have any exact matches in Variety Vista. There are examples that are close but not close enough. That's why I classify it a discovery.

[mustbebob]

This looks like machine doubling (MD) to me. The 'doubling' cuts into the top of the letters and there is no verifiable notching that I can make out at this point.

[Coindog]

Mustbebob, I'm not looking at the tops of the lettering with regards to the DDO/DDR. I agree that there is MD going on. It's because of that die degradation and the Obv. and Rev. matching relative to the examples I have made in VarietyVista, which leads me to believe my example is an extreme late die stage, (ELDS). The closest I've been able to ascertain is that it's a DDO-001/DDR-004, both (ELDS).
I wish I could post more photos of IN GOD WE TRUST and AMERICA. maybe I will.

[Kloccwork419]

Cant see doubling in these pics. Maybe diffuse the glare some more. Might see a little on E but cant tell for sure from the glare and I know how hard it is to take a pic thru that plastic. Try a few different light angles.
I’ve never liked the word discovery.

[Coindog]

Kloccwork419, I've been experimenting with different ways to defuse my microscope lighting but still haven't found an ideal solution. I'll keep working on it though. I may have come up with idea. I'll try it with some new pics.
I'll stop using discovery.

[Kloccwork419]

Try some coffee filter. I know some people that use them. I use Canson Opalux myself. You can get it from an art store or online. It works great.

[MintErrors]

Kloccwork419, I've been experimenting with different ways to defuse my microscope lighting but still haven't found an ideal solution. I'll keep working on it though. I may have come up with idea. I'll try it with some new pics.
I'll stop using discovery.

For diffusing light, I use sheer white cloth you can buy at a fabric store.
About a yard or so of a few different densities. I drape it over the microscope like a tent and use portable lighting to move as needed. I have a trinocular AMSCOPE microscope with a 16MP digital microscope camera. It takes some great close up photos. Use as much layers as required, or simply turn the light(s) about 45 degrees to cut back some of the intensity... or buy a device that offers a variable level of lighting.

I post a lot of photos the system is capable here and on my website.
Lighting is the #1 pain to obtain good photos - ask Jason C. , the lead attributer.
=)

[MintErrors]

This looks like machine doubling (MD) to me. The 'doubling' cuts into the top of the letters and there is no verifiable notching that I can make out at this point.

One thing. CONECA does pay attention to die marriages. When the master listings were available - I don't know if they are now or not - they would have a reference number showing which dies were used together. I don't know if your thinking it's a DDO/DDR combo, but its best to see if those dies were ever used together in the same minting press. One of the few oddball varieties that I can remember is a 1964 DDO/RPM-006 I think it was. They DO occur, but it is pretty rare. If the CONECA master listing lists the possibility of a DDO/DDR for that year, then it may be a possibility.

[MintErrors]

Mustbebob, I'm not looking at the tops of the lettering with regards to the DDO/DDR. I agree that there is MD going on. It's because of that die degradation and the Obv. and Rev. matching relative to the examples I have made in VarietyVista, which leads me to believe my example is an extreme late die stage, (ELDS). The closest I've been able to ascertain is that it's a DDO-001/DDR-004, both (ELDS).
I wish I could post more photos of IN GOD WE TRUST and AMERICA. maybe I will.

One thing. CONECA does pay attention to die marriages. When the master listings were available - I don't know if they are now or not - they would have a reference number showing which dies were used together.

I don't know if your thinking it's a DDO/DDR combo, but its best to see if those dies were ever used together in the same minting press.

One of the few oddball varieties that I can remember is a 1964 DDO/RPM-006 I think it was.

They DO occur, but it is pretty rare. If the CONECA master listing lists the possibility of a DDO/DDR for that year, then it may be a possibility.

[Coindog]

One thing. CONECA does pay attention to die marriages. When the master listings were available - I don't know if they are now or not - they would have a reference number showing which dies were used together.

I don't know if your thinking it's a DDO/DDR combo, but its best to see if those dies were ever used together in the same minting press.

One of the few oddball varieties that I can remember is a 1964 DDO/RPM-006 I think it was.

They DO occur, but it is pretty rare. If the CONECA master listing lists the possibility of a DDO/DDR for that year, then it may be a possibility.

How can I find out if the two dies I suspect were used together?

[MintErrors]

That is a question for a CONECA appointed staff member. They may have access to the CONECA master listing, but it may not be ready for the general public. That would be the only way I think that would confirm that two doubled dies were in the same minting press at the same time. Variety Vista may still list possibilities on some of theose combo's, but since he returned the master listing back to CONECA, his site seems to be void of any mention of CONECA.

I cannot offer anything more than that. The newer listing may be more accurate than the old listing. Some websites might have info about the master listings, but I would tread lightly there.

If such a combo existed, I would imagine John Wexler having mention to it at his site. I have not looked to closely, but here is the link:

http://doubleddie.com/1851704.html

[Coindog]

That is a question for a CONECA appointed staff member. They may have access to the CONECA master listing, but it may not be ready for the general public. That would be the only way I think that would confirm that two doubled dies were in the same minting press at the same time. Variety Vista may still list possibilities on some of theose combo's, but since he returned the master listing back to CONECA, his site seems to be void of any mention of CONECA.

I cannot offer anything more than that. The newer listing may be more accurate than the old listing. Some websites might have info about the master listings, but I would tread lightly there.

If such a combo existed, I would imagine John Wexler having mention to it at his site. I have not looked to closely, but here is the link:

http://doubleddie.com/1851704.html

John Wexler lives close to me and I've been contemplating dropping several of my coins off for him to examine. It's starting to look like that's a likely move.
Variety Vista does list DDO/DDR'S but it doesn't say which Obverse die was used with which Reverse die. It just says in the die stage, the obverse or reverse is also (MDS) or (LDS).