New Variety Error

[mustbebob]

I know Bill. I really hear you. I know you are not trying to be problematic. I will leave it at this. This club, or any others like it will never be 100% up to date because there is no way to determine what 100% is. It is an ever growing and expanding hobby and relies on volunteers to get it done. Everything you look at about the hobby came from other collectors over the years. Based on that alone, we are in it for the long haul.
We will chat again some time, and I hope we can get to your coin soon.

[BilbosRainbow]

Thanks again Bob for your response. I had no intention to be problematic, but I do think you have exaggerated and misconstrued the essence of my legitimate inquiry, what I've asked about, and what I've been trying to say ... which very simply is that if the club is based on varieties and errors (as you say), my concern and the point I've been trying to make is merely that I think those foundational elements should be kept 100% up-to-date to maintain the viability of what the club is supposed to be about - and especially so since your organization is one that is relied upon to make decisions on what varieties and errors will be "officially" recognized throughout the hobby.

So once again I'll just wait patiently for attributions to open up again for Lincoln cents, and rely upon yours' and others' decades of experience in these matters.

[Nfoster76]

I am a collector variety hunter! I’m looking for varieties that aren’t out there yet

[Nfoster76]

CA199C08-0724-4041-81CC-958652788B67.jpeg A small part of my collection. First of all you first of all you know know me. You don’t know the thousands of hours I’ve gotten to this! Because your form only allows 8 Photos if that! Sometimes it takes up to 16 to 23! This is not a joke or a game! I have a question about a couple I posted, for fun! I haven’t even begun to share, i’m just trying to figure this forum out! I’m a member but it won’t let me register to certain Forums. I believe I’ve asked for help! Let’s take the mule clash for example. Must be 2 opposing dies. What is it was an attributed correctly. Because I can show you Coins with the Obverse and reverse of the dime. I wouldn’t make it a mule clash. What about the 70 S quarter! Over the 41 Canadian? Graded examples say 5.63 as the weight, that does not match the Canadian planchet! I’m glad examples on the 70 S clad and 70 D. There’s a lot of things that don’t make sense. I can show you a peace dollar with VDB clearly on the reverse. 2 1910 cents with VDB. But there’s no record of it being used and 1910. This is not my first day! I would like to have some answers. What do you think anybody get the mint is going to answer’ I don’t think so. I don’t need to post them on the phone I will email them to you! Am I only allowed to post known-varieties! If So, I wasn’t aware of that

[mustbebob]

It is a 'hobby' that has been going on for hundreds of years. worldwide Money is not the 'club'. Varieties and errors are. That's where you are not understanding things correctly. Things are not done 'Willy-Nilly' either based on someone else's time. Maybe you have time to tell everyone what they have been doing wrong all these years because they don't have enough time to look at your coin?
I have had enough of trying to explain this to you Bill. I feel like nothing I say will change your incorrect perception of this hobby and those people who have worked on it voluntarily for decades and decades. You are free to learn it all yourself, and dedicate all of your time to people just like you who want something on their time frame. If it is so bad that you dislike the 'patience' aspect I gave you some options and I strongly suggest you read up on these so called lazy clubs. See how willy-nilly we are. See how many of the tens of thousands of people who spend billions of dollars actually exist. Your views on this hobby are terribly inaccurate. You think this is something it is not. I am sorry we are failing to meet your expectation.

BTW...How do you suggest we pay people for

determining the multifarious nuances in varieties and errors upon which ultimate values are heavily weighted, and which definitely makes coins and currencies more valuable to all who participate.

Whose guidelines do you use? What kind of clientele will we have? Is 5 bucks a coin too much? What happens after I tell you you have a 2 dollar variety? Is a multi-million dollar corporation needed to do that? How about a 'club' with a dozen or so hard core hobbyists who are willing to give a little bit of their precious time to help others who are not as well versed in that area? To me, it sounds and works better that way.

Remember that all of this came about because you don't want to wait or because you disagree with our policies. I do not know if you will be patient or not, but it seems that there is plenty you have to say about something you don't understand yet.

[BilbosRainbow]

HI Bob ... and thanks again for responding.

I'm not complaining (or maybe I am, who knows),it's just that I do not understand how a so-called "hobby" -- which has world-wide impact that involves literally billions of dollars in transactions annually -- has not advanced beyond being like a "club" (as you call is) or a hobby where determinations of varieties and errors are just done willy-nilly based on whether or not someone has time to do it.

I'm a very rational and pragmatic person, and it just seems to me that there should be regular ongoing "scientific confirmation of all distinguishing anomalies" (attribution) among coins and currencies that become recognized by the community of tens of thousands of participants and advocates involved worldwide, and who spend billions of dollars annually accumulating collections or just purchasing individual items.

It seems that great organization has gone into the grading, buying, and selling aspects (the auctions, etc.), but not so much into determining the multifarious nuances in varieties and errors upon which ultimate values are heavily weighted, and which definitely makes coins and currencies more valuable to all who participate.

In the meantime, I'll wait patiently ... :-))

[mustbebob]

CONECA is not the only attribution club out there Bill. They are however, the most recognized. Different denominations have different clubs in some cases.
Third party grading services grade and authenticate coins. They don't have time to do attributions. This practice of grading or authenticating a coin takes considerably less time than trying to attribute anything.
You are displaying some of the very same issues as most everyone who has what they think is a new discovery. Why is is so slow? Why do I have to wait? Why don't people have a better handle on this? I want to get credit for this before someone else does.
I tried to explain earlier that this is a hobby. People do this for the love of the hobby. Attributions are not something required to make a paycheck so that you or your family can make a living, and it takes a long time to get proficient enough to do it. If it was so simple, we wouldn't be trying to teach people to self attribute. I don't know what else to tell you. The Internet is a wonderful thing, and if you do a little research, you will find tons of info out there about the same things you are questioning. I will ask again that you be patient. What else is can I say?

[BilbosRainbow]

HI Bob ..Thanks again. But I do have a question: Is CONECA the only organization that officially attributes varieties for the entirety of the numismatic hobby? I wonder why a department for attribution of "new varieties" has not been added to the control of the grading companies or other points of control within the numismatics community. In all honesty, it seems like attribution is something that should be an "ongoing" thing, and not subject to when a company or individual decides it's time for attributions for a certain denomination to open up. It's inefficient and just seems weird to me. But I'll just wait patiently..

[mustbebob]

It would be announced on the forum Bill. Although I am sure the attributers wouldn't mind a few extra dollars, it just wouldn't be right to bypass someone who has been waiting patiently for longer than you. When I was an attributer, the offer was made to me many times, especially when a new variety was discovered on newly minted coins.
Having your comments in this forum is another way to show when you first reported this coin. If it turns out to be an actual variety, and multiple people report the same variety, your proof is already here. We do appreciate your patience and as I stated, we will take care of you.

[BilbosRainbow]

Dear Bob ... thank you so much for your prompt response. It certainly gives me a better understanding of the process and of the timeframe involved, especially since there's no full-time person doing the attributions. So this info is very much appreciated! $5 is not much to charge for an attribution, and I certainly would be willing to pay more (or to include a greater cash incentive for the attributor) to get my coin attributed.

Just one other question: Will it be announced on the website (or another place) when attributions are opened again for a given denomination?

Thanks again for your time and consideration.

Sincerely,
William ("Bill") Bailey (aka ... BilbosRainbow)

[mustbebob]

The determination of when attributions will be open depends on getting an attributer on board, and when the staff is ready with the master listings and other things we are trying to do to get ready. Please try to remember that doing attributions and/or examinations is not something that just happens. These positions are filled with highly skilled and trained individuals on a voluntary basis. The lead attributer and CONECA board must agree to that person's qualifications. This is not a paid job either, except for the fees that will be charged for each individual attribution. The attributer does it based on his personal schedule. They may have real jobs, families, and other interests that would take precedent over doing an attribution for a few dollars. They have to have a love for this hobby in order to do that job also.

I understand your excitement about maybe having a new variety. I also understand that things are not going as quickly as we would like with starting attributions. I can not give you a time frame because I don't know of one. Our lead attributer will make the call on what denomination starts and when. He has a full time job too, so he has a lot to deal with. Once an attributer is assigned to that denomination, you would contact him/her to schedule your attribution, fees, time frame etc.

I can only ask you to continue to be patient. Also remember that you are not the only one out there who would like their coins looked at. None of this is what you want to hear, but it is what's up to date at this point.

[BilbosRainbow]

Hello again Bob ... Can you tell me that determines when a particular denomination is opened for attribution submissions? Can you be a little more precise as to what "a bit" means, and when [perhaps in the number of months(?)] attributions might opened up again for Lincoln Cents? From what I can determine, what I have will be a new variety, and I definitely want to submit it for attribution. Thanks again for your time and consideration.

[mustbebob]

You sent the photos to the wrong person, and he was gracious enough to forward them to me. I would prefer not to be sent anything pertaining to the forum to my personal email address.
As you said, it is very clear for you to see them, but you have the benefit of having the item in hand. I still can not make a determination based on any photos submitted. If you want it to be looked at and possibly attributed as a new doubled die, then please wait a bit until the attributions for Lincoln cents is opened. Our lead attributer will make the call on when that will be and you can then submit your coin to the appropriate attributer.

[BilbosRainbow]

Mustbebob ... I sent you an email with pics attached.

[BilbosRainbow]

I am again attaching picc of the DOUBLE THUMB, which appear very clear from my end. The pics might be losing revolution when being transferred from my phone and downloading them to my computer, and then again to attach them here to send to you. It would be better if I could send them directly from my phone or computer to an email address. So if you cannot clearly see the Double Thumb, is it possible that you could provide me with an email address to which I can send the pics?