1922 peace dollar, wounded eagle!

[CoinCollector2.0]

My warmest greetings to all respected, and kind bravuras at Coneca.

I hope everyone is making the best out of this pandemic.

Attached are some pictures for the reference in respect to this 1922 peace dollar, which I believe could be consider for wounded eagle of this era.

A couple of these peace dollars where recently founded in my business Acquaintance grandpa’s treasure chest, one of which I recently sent to PCGS for grading, and came back as an MS64.
the second one seems normal however, I found this particular one odd.

Sincerely,

Your Coin Collector 2.0

[mustbebob]

JUST A HEADS UP...The following comment is the result of my utter distain for naming coins that have some sort of error on them. I have hated it ever since I heard of the 3-legged Buffalo. way back in the 60s. I just need to vent I guess. If you have a love for naming your coins, and you think these cute names are cool, don't read any further. If you kinda like smart a** remarks from someone who is just tired of this sort of thing, read on.

Absolutely NOTHING against CoinCollector2.0. This coin is his baby and it is a beautiful coin.

Here goes...

I am curious as to why you want to name this a wounded eagle? The term wasn't even used until the year 2000 and the Sacagawea Dollar. I guess my point is that people often give these types of names to pretty common errors or conditions like crack, chips, or clashes. Why only wounded and not badly injured or dead eagle? (Very sarcastic) At what point does it become a wounded eagle and not a speared eagle? Where is the criteria for being able to call it that? For the life of me, I don't know why this sort of thing needs to be part of this hobby. If it ends up being for financial gains, I border on calling that unethical. Then again, there is precedence for things like this out there, and I don't have to like it...do I?

[CoinCollector2.0]

JUST A HEADS UP...The following comment is the result of my utter distain for naming coins that have some sort of error on them. I have hated it ever since I heard of the 3-legged Buffalo. way back in the 60s. I just need to vent I guess. If you have a love for naming your coins, and you think these cute names are cool, don't read any further. If you kinda like smart a** remarks from someone who is just tired of this sort of thing, read on.

Absolutely NOTHING against CoinCollector2.0. This coin is his baby and it is a beautiful coin.

Here goes...

I am curious as to why you want to name this a wounded eagle? The term wasn't even used until the year 2000 and the Sacagawea Dollar. I guess my point is that people often give these types of names to pretty common errors or conditions like crack, chips, or clashes. Why only wounded and not badly injured or dead eagle? (Very sarcastic) At what point does it become a wounded eagle and not a speared eagle? Where is the criteria for being able to call it that? For the life of me, I don't know why this sort of thing needs to be part of this hobby. If it ends up being for financial gains, I border on calling that unethical. Then again, there is precedence for things like this out there, and I don't have to like it...do I?

mustbebob

My sincere apologies if, I hurt your feelings Bob Piazza. That has been said; the old school rule of thumb was, if you were to hunt, you would use bow arrows and when guns were created for hunting, hunters changed the old school tactics in order to hunt with much easing tools! However, I personally believe that the animal which was hunted by the bow arrows their meat taste way better then the ones are hunted by the gunshot. There is many different approved numismatic websites which attributes coin their way, what I mean by this is that, unfortunately when it comes to coin collecting attributes we do not have standards set by the numismatic world yet. I might’ve said it because, it was used millions of times before I mentioned it here.

I am lucky to be corrected by the experts who have wealth of knowledge in respect to coin collecting, which I understand, and consider my self blessed but, when newer generations steps in to this hobby, they will always find different ways, and will try to change the names of attributes unless the numismatic world comes up with standards set by numismatic world for good and for all.

Just a suggestion.

Sincerely,

Coin Collector 2.0

[mustbebob]

First of all CoinCollector2.0, I really do appreciate your participation in the subject. This is just one of those things that has been eating at my mind for decades now, and I am happy to find someone at least willing to engage in a discussion. Please feel free to tell me I am going overboard on this and I will graciously back off. I do realize that circumstances put you here, and that may not be where you want to be.

I hear what you are saying, but it has nothing to do with bows and arrows and meat. I am just trying to understand the mentality that goes into things like this.

As I mentioned already...I personally hate it, but that is my personal preference. I am seriously trying to delve into the mind of someone who does use the terms, and maybe it could give me a different perspective that I have missed. This is not an exercise in right and wrong, but I really want to know.

I do not find that assigning names to coins is funny, lighthearted, or necessary, and I think it detracts from the serious side of numismatics. If you were to look up the definition of numismatics, you wouldn't see anything having to do with naming coins by virtue of an error as one of its core values.

In your opinion...If some entity (numismatic or not) decides to call it something (let's use wounded eagle), what makes you agree or disagree that you want to call your coin that? Did seeing that die crack on your coin bring visions of a wounded eagle immediately? If someone on eBay calls it that, does that mean the name should stick? Who names any of these things anyway?

Of course, you could name your coin whatever you want, but I asked you why you felt it was a wounded eagle, especially since your coin was made 88 years before the term was apparently first used? That was your interpretation and I was just curious as to what you knew that made you use that analogy. You know as well as I do that no numismatic super power will ever address issues like this, so I realize it is probably a mute point.

There is also an ulterior motive to all this. I made mention of it in my last post, but I think this sort of thing is dangerous to newer collectors, and that makes it a bad thing. I can not guess how many people have made purchases based on fancy names given to otherwise normal coins. If you think back to a lot of names used, like 'spitting horse', high leaf, low leaf (they are not leaves at all), speared eagles, 3 legged buffalos etc., they are all figments of someone's imagination. They are not those things at all. If these names are used to sell coins, then in my mind, it becomes unethical. That is why I am so keen on education. People should know what they are getting, and if they know that these are just fancy names for cracks or other anomalies, then the choice is all theirs. I have a hard time thinking a die crack should entice anyone to spend more money than they should have. As far as I know, there will never be a place where values of these common errors under these names would be catalogued and priced.

You don't have to, but any other comments?

[jcuve]

I am not a huge fan of naming things like this, but I am not as grumpy as Bob. Some of them seem okay. I don't mind the three legged buffalo for example. I don't know what the protocols should be. Just throwing it out there, I feel like there should be more than one example, and maybe it should be naked eye obvious. One thing that does really bother me about naming them, is the dollar amount that can be associated with it. Almost all of them are just gouges, dents or anomalies that have nothing to do with the "name" given and shouldn't be worth much if anything. And the whole phenomena has just gotten worse in the past 25 or so years.

Anyway, that's a nice Peace Dollar. The anomaly in question is too minor to be considered collectible in its own right. Naming it is probably not a good idea - and I kind of think I am with Bob in that I don't really want to see any more "wounded" coins...

[CoinCollector2.0]

mustbebob jcuve First of all; I would like to thank you both for your astute enlightenment , and I really appreciate the integrity behind the logic. I do not want to sound patronizing yet, I believe in order for me to call my self a full time hobbyist, I will have to learn, and grow more in the numismatic world. For me every day is a new day, and every day I learn something new.

Furthermore; I do appreciate the offer of disengagement yet, I welcome your professionalism, & hospitality with ethical approach & full integrity.

It is not up to me what I want, or what I do not want? These are the paved roads which I take in order to, have a smooth transition which were constructed decades ago, by so called dignified professional coin graders, and dealers!


Getting inside my head, or finding out where am I coming from shall be of a less scrutinize to the numismatic world. More precisely Numismatic world shall pursue current coin graders, and dealers in order to, draw demarcation line, so the future of coin collecting /numismatic could be handled with full dignity, integrity.
In addition, an ethical code of conduct board is essential with certain standards without which, all my talk, he said, she said is baseless.

Hence, a complete reform is requisite in order to maintain the integrity of coin collecting which could be thanked by the future generations to come.

I am in no place in order to influence others what I think, or what steps are deemed to be taken?
jcuve Bob is not grumpy at all, he has a legitimate concern which needs to be addressed in the numismatic world, which has been ignored for decades over decades.

God bless you both for shooting straight, as for me, I always admire straight shooters.

Sincerely,

Coin Collector 2.0

[mustbebob]

I Love it! Jason called me grumpy. I am sure he is just being polite. However, it is I that would like to thank you Coincollector2.0 for your willingness to engage in this conversation. It was nice to see someone speak his/her mind without being righteous.
I do appreciate everyone's point of view on this subject. If I knew how, I would take this problem head on. It seems we used to have advocates against this sort of thing, but like many other things, life goes on.
One thing I have to disagree with you on. You said

I am in no place in order to influence others what I think, or what steps are deemed to be taken?

I think you ARE in position to make a change or influence others. If you are passionate about the hobby, we need people just like you to continue the hobby. After all...JasonC is getting pretty old now. I stopped aging about 50 years ago, so I am good for now.

Thanks again for everything. This was fun!

=BOB=

[CoinCollector2.0]

Pleasure is all mine, and I am truly blessed to have the honour of being engaged with such open minded, and respectful human beings at this stage of my life. As once a wise person said “ And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years.“

“ I think you ARE in position to make a change or influence others. If you are passionate about the hobby, we need people just like you to continue the hobby. “

I truly acclaim your phlegm in me. I am already in theatre & engaged however, due to unforeseen circumstances, I may not be able to get skirmish with full time in the near future yet, I am optimistic about the future.

“After all...JasonC is getting pretty old now. I stopped aging about 50 years ago, so I am good for now.“

With all due respect, and excuse my ignorance, age is just a number! Notwithstanding; I believe by making excuses about the numbers in our lives makes us lax not old. I believe the day we are done in this world, that’s when we are old, and your sense of humour tells me that you are way younger then you think. Having said that, the impression, & resources which you, and respected JasonC has, I don’t have that yet. I still have to make an impression in the coin industry; and reading articles, and doing my own digging over the years, One thing I vastly noticed is that, those who wants to get in to this hobby unfortunately 90% established coin dealers, and so called experts discourage them in the first place, by stealing the tools from them, and ripping them off by being lowballing, & telling them that what they have discovered was hardly worth face value who takes advantage of others innocence, and they always looks for opportunities, and happiness in others distress, who are businessmen’s not a hobbyist.

In conclusion; with a bit of effort from all of you in the Coneca family, and in the numismatic universe could certainly create spaceX for the future generations to continue this hobby in planet Mars, and beyond by bringing everything under the same umbrella.

Once again my apologies if, I said something which was not polite, or came across Derogatory which was never my intentions.

God bless, stay healthy and safe.

Coin Collector 2.0