1958 D 1c ODV-010 Over ODV-021

[LoyVA2]

IMG_117.JPG

Look at the G in GOD. It has the ODV-010 profile. Maybe a triple overdate and over mint mark as well. I think this is a retired San Francisco B/S die re-hubbed for the Denver mint.

[MintErrors]

In my opinion, the sole photo is not centered, it's tilted which does not offer a good chance to zoom in and see what is going on.

ODV 10 was used in the 1920s to mid 1930s. ODV 21 was used during 1957 to 1959. IF this was used in this manner, the overdate would be so easily spotted and immediately destroyed. Plus, this would mean working dies are kept at the mint, retired for more than 20 + years.

This is a 1958 year coin. If something like this existed, I believe it would have been found a long time ago. It's not about a single coin, the Lincoln working dies can strike up to one million coins before being retired. There are a lot of working dies made from the same working hub. All of these working dies were probably made in Philadelphia and shipped to other Mints. They would not need to rehub a working die to change a mintmark. Mintmarks were simply punched one over another. More that likely this is not the case, since nothing has been found from the 1958D Lincolns in respect to a repunched date and OMM for the past 65+ years.

This diecappears to be in good enough shape not to be placed into an out of service status. The working dies taken out of service are late to very late die stage working dies who are close to or at the end of their service life. They are worn down and have the signs of eventual catastrophic fail.

1944 and 1946 were the last Lincoln cents with an OMM. The last repunch date for copper coins was in the very early 1900s with the Indian Head cents. I don't remember when the last overdate on copper was performed.

I suggest coming back at a later date and approach this hypothetical scenario logically. Most of the times, one should not take a leap of faith on the possibility of a single letter when in the mechanical world of the minting process, wierd thing happen allowing for coincidences to occur.

[LoyVA2]

MintErrors, Thank you for your response, your expert opinion and advice. I rely on it. That is why I joined CONECA as a paying member, so I can pick the brains of experts like you. Thank you for your assistance! I have been sitting on these coins for about 5 years because I know they are not supposed to exist, as described. I took your advice about the pictures and bought some new equipment. I'll post new pictures next week after it gets here.

[LoyVA2]

I had six of these graded before I realized what they could be. I called the local coin dealer and had him look at this coin online. He said yes to obverse doubling and said he was interested in them when I get them verified. I then took three raw coins to the same dealer and his college grad assistant was emphatic yes to all three being DDO. That was two years ago. I invite you and all who would like to, to view these 6 coins online to get a better view. The numbers are sequential with the last 3 digits starting at 139 and ending at 144.

[LoyVA2]

I hope this image is better suited to this forum. 1958_D_1c_DDO_LoyVA2.JPG

[LoyVA2]

[LoyVA2]

You can see a 7 through the top and down the right side of the 8. The D is defined by a pair of S's. One on either side of the mintmark.

[eaxtellcoin]

Hello LoyVA2,
I'm going to move this post to the General Forum.
The Die Variety Forum is the place to discuss Double Dies and RPM's

As for the photo attached. I zoomed his photo - overpixelated. Means the camera taking the photo was in the "REG" setting. The camera should be set to "Fine" setting and then you will need to crop the photo down to upload - it will be more than 5000 pixels.

1958-D-Coneca.jpg
Hope this helps,
Eric

[LoyVA2]

Hello Eric and thank you for your helpful suggestion! I'll get right on it. Regards, Loy

[LoyVA2]

Here is a coin from a die that does not exist. Please confirm DDO, RPD, RPM, OVERDATE and OVERMM 37566143_Obv.jpg

[eaxtellcoin]

Loy, I'm sorry I have no idea where you are going with:
Please confirm DDO, RPD, RPM, OVERDATE and OVERMM
DDO is a Double Die OBV, Re punched date do you mean 8 over 7, """be specific - with arrows,"""" RPM is a re punched Mintmark, Overdate again do you mean 8 over 7? and Over mintmark means OMM or a D over an S which this coin cannot be. Please learn the terms.
1) RPM: I do not see anything to confirm: I don't think this is an RPM. Plus zoomed it's somewhat Blurry.
1958D_PCGS_Coneca(1).jpg
2) The eye doesn't appeared doubled and "In God We" does not appear doubled either:
The "E" of We is the only possibility I see with the photo from PCGS used.

1958D_PCGS_Coneca(2).jpg 1958D_PCGS_Coneca(5).jpg
3) Liberty is the only possibility I see but the photo is also blurry zoomed in.
We would need a close up of ""Liberty"" in focus and close up to confirm.

1958D_PCGS_Coneca(4).jpg
Thanks,
Eric

[MintErrors]

You can see a 7 through the top and down the right side of the 8. The D is defined by a pair of S's. One on either side of the mintmark.

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In my opinion, the D looks normal. There aren't any "s" that I can see by the D. They did hammer the mintmark into the working die. It can dent the working die in the flat field around the D.

The working die has to exist in order for a coin to be made.

As Eric has said, the only thing MIGHT be something on LIBERTY.

Although the newer microscopes are great, they can show things at such high magnification that it looks like something major, but is minor.

[LoyVA2]

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In my opinion, the D looks normal. There aren't any "s" that I can see by the D. They did hammer the mintmark into the working die. It can dent the working die in the flat field around the D.

The working die has to exist in order for a coin to be made.

As Eric has said, the only thing MIGHT be something on LIBERTY.

Although the newer microscopes are great, they can show things at such high magnification that it looks like something major, but is minor.

1957_D_1c_D_over_S.JPG
In my opinion, the S enters the D at the one o'clock position, and exits the D at the four o'clock position

[onecent1909]

In my opinion, the S enters the D at the one o'clock position, and exits the D at the four o'clock position

Hello, I have to let you know, You have had 2 specialist inform you of their opinions.
I concur that this is not a ODV variety, not a OMM variety, and not a RPD as the 58/7 has been disproven.
The Philly and Denver 1958/7 has been disproven and unlisted as it is a die dent.

there is no possible way of ODV-010 over ODV-021. as stated there are 2 different sets of years decades apart.
dies that are hardened to strike coins would not be rehubbed. the mint now removes details and destroys dies after the year they were created for.

this G is Not the same G as on a ODV-010 so on your coin that one is disproven.
A old striking die would not be rehubbed, so that is disproven on your coin.
Die detail is to strong for this to be a retired die......
With that... this is not a die with a S mint mark as it can not be an older die with a newer date.... as so
the S mint mark were pulled in 1955 and San Fran stopped making coins until 1968. so this is disproven on your coin.
the 58/7 have been disproven as die dents so again on your coin that is disproven although some are still in previous certified slabs.

This is not an opinion but a given and proven fact.
I am sorry, but you are trying to make a variety coin that is not there and have had specialist that have years of knowledge let you know that this is not a RPM, not a OMM, not a doubled die obverse, and not a ODV variety.
Sorry but no.
John Miller.

[LoyVA2]

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How about a tripled date AND a D/S. There is no denying it now!